{"contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"jackjacobs"}

Is It Really All About The Money?

This coming week, Secretary of Defense Robert Gates is expected to announce significant changes in armed forces weapons and acquisition programs. As we embark on a mission to defend against the growth of al-Qaeda and the Taliban in southwest Asia, it seems that Gates wants to reduce expenditures for some big-ticket systems and increase capability to fight unconventional war. It will be interesting to see how well he succeeds.

We have always grappled with the problem of deciding what wars we should be armed to fight, but most of the time we got it wrong. We were unprepared for nearly every conflict, even when we had plenty of warning, and in some cases actually went out of our way to fight wars whose objectives---to say nothing of the capability to achieve them---were only sketchily outlined.

There are two root problems at work. The first is that nobody can see into the future. Even when there is clarity about the strategic objective, there are too many actors and independent variables to make reliable predictions about what will happen, and this is true even in regions in which we are paying attention because we have a strong security interest. So our choice is to prepare for everything, or to make choices that entail risks that really can't be calculated.

Second, and no less important, is that we believe we can't prepare for every contingency because we can't afford to do so. Government costs money, and lots of it, but the government doesn't have control over fixed entitlement costs---Social Security, government pensions and debt service chief among them---leaving the remainder pretty much a zero-sum game. So, even if we wanted to prepare for everything, we can't print enough money to do so without propelling the cost of bread to hundreds of dollars a loaf. We must be selective about what we buy.

And we have committed to buying lots of expensive things, including airplanes and ships that are designed to be most effective to deter, or to prevail in, conventional conflict with other nation-states, not in an unconventional struggle with Muslim revolutionaries. Few observers expect the F-22, for example, to be the weapon that permits us to prevail decisively in Afghanistan, but we are buying it just the same because we may need it against Russia or China, about whom we can't afford to be sanguine.

Meanwhile, we have insufficient numbers of soldiers and Marines, of intelligence production operators, of mobile training teams, of a host of other things that we need in low-intensity combat, and Gates reportedly will try to redress the imbalance. He will need plenty of luck in this endeavor.

The Executive Branch doesn't have a great deal to say about the budget because, in the end, no money can be spent until the Congress appropriates it. In many cases, of course, the two branches negotiate and agree, but that is most often only at the margins. Especially in the difficult economic environment we have today, it will be tough to convince a legislator that valuable defense jobs in his state or district should be trimmed. And so in the end the government will field a sub-optimal force to cope with what the president says is a problem that we need to solve, and the outcome will be anybody's guess.

{"contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"jackjacobs"}
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{"commentId":6313892,"authorDomain":"jabeck"}

It may seem that war is about money, at times.  When we went into Iraq many people said it was for the oil and the big government contracts for rebuilding Iraq's infrastructure.  And, it does cost a lot of money to wage a war.  However, in Iraq's case it was about it being the softest target we could hit after 9/11.  We did do a good thing by taking out Saddam Husein, but we left a country with a civil war to fight.  And, it won't matter if we pull our troops out tomorrow or three years from now, Iraq will become a blood bath.

As expensive as wars are it's rarely about money.  Rather it's about power and saving face.  There seems to be a type of genetic way of thinking that has been with our species forever.  A type of mentality that is exemplified in the quote, "You toucha my car, I breaka you face."  As a semi-literate human with half a brain, even I realize that we can't continue to operate within a global community like this anymore.  Terrorism, the environment, economics, damn near everything..."It's a global tang, baby."

{"commentId":6313892,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"jabeck"}
  • 3 votes
Reply#1 - Sat Apr 4, 2009 11:44 AM EDT
{"commentId":6446152,"authorDomain":"goldnmypoc2"}

I'd say you really need to rethink that wars are not about money, as history tells its own story. As far as Iraq is concerned, right now Iraq is more prosperous that we are here in the US. They just might enjoy that new found freedom, on the backs of US taxpayers.

{"commentId":6446152,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"goldnmypoc2"}
  • 1 vote
#1.1 - Sun Apr 12, 2009 1:57 PM EDT
{"commentId":6478297,"authorDomain":"v1ly4"}

You know, you can never judge the success of a program by how much money you throw at it.

Democrats want to throw trillions of dollars at inefficient, anti-poverty welfare programs, and if you don't support them, you "don't care about poor people".

Republicans want to throw trillions of dollars at cold-war-era defense programs, and if you don't support them, you're weak and you "don't support protecting America".

To be fair, and correct myself, both parties are bought out by special interests, including the military-industrial complex.

But we simply shouldn't be spending more on weapons than the entire world combined. We would achieve MORE national security by spending a trillion dollars on electric-powered high-speed rail and battery-electric vehicle development and deployment than the same trillion dollars on high-tech weapons that we don't need or use. And we'd create jobs either way, so let's invest in oil-independence!

{"commentId":6478297,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"v1ly4"}
    #1.2 - Tue Apr 14, 2009 1:43 PM EDT
    Reply
    {"commentId":6313923,"authorDomain":"farmer"}

    There appears to be a simple solution to being prepared for the latest. Wait for the latest to appear. Not practical you say? With the exception of certain constants like POL, C-rations, cigarettes, beer and the USO we have had to prepare for each war and skirmish as it came upon us. Being prepared for any contingency only makes us ill prepared for what adversaries bring upon us. We have never successfully conducted a war or police action with the tactics and equipment that were used in the most previous one. We keep using F-22's to do a job that could be done with a Piper Cub. Do you suppose overkill is part of the reason we have so many complaints of collateral damage?

    {"commentId":6313923,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"farmer"}
    • 5 votes
    Reply#2 - Sat Apr 4, 2009 11:46 AM EDT
    {"commentId":6314643,"authorDomain":"wharrison55"}

    Good article, Col. Jacobs. Given this administration and the Democratic Congress's priorities Sec. Gates will have to fight for every nickel for the armed forces and he will have to make some tough choices. Obama's rhetoric notwithstanding, the force remains too small for the current operational planning which still calls for conducting two theatre-sized conflicts simultaneously. I believe that we should start rethinking our alliance structure that is constructed upon a Cold War edifice that no longer obtains. Why on earth shouldn't the Europeans, Japanese and South Koreans, inter alia, be doing more by way of providing for their own defense? And despite all of the happy talk emanating from the NATO meeting in the end the Germans are unlikely to do any more than they've done already which is primarily limited to sitting on their asses drinking beer and sweet tea in Mazar I Sharif. And I might add, at the same time undercutting the supposed united front regarding Iran's nuclear program by dint of German companies many business dealings with Tehran.

    {"commentId":6314643,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"wharrison55"}
    • 8 votes
    Reply#3 - Sat Apr 4, 2009 12:43 PM EDT
    {"commentId":6316314,"authorDomain":"jackjacobs"}

    After the president's presser today, it's clear that the Europeans are going to nod sagely in agreement but do little. The irony is that Europe is, in some respects, more at risk from terrorism than we are. They have large, restive, unemployed Muslim minorities that are, by and large, not integrated into the rest of society.

    {"commentId":6316314,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"jackjacobs"}
    • 8 votes
    #3.1 - Sat Apr 4, 2009 2:54 PM EDT
    {"commentId":6317899,"authorDomain":"wharrison55"}

    After watching how Geert Wilders was treated, especially by Gordon Brown's government, I can only believe that many European governments are genuinely frightened about the prospects for homegrown terrorism in their ranks and are simply kowtowing out of fear.

    {"commentId":6317899,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"wharrison55"}
    • 5 votes
    #3.2 - Sat Apr 4, 2009 4:57 PM EDT
    {"commentId":6325050,"authorDomain":"jbdaad"}

    Col. Jack Jacobs

    They have large, restive, unemployed Muslim minorities that are, by and large, not integrated into the rest of society.

    What needs to be done for better relations?

    {"commentId":6325050,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"jbdaad"}
    • 2 votes
    #3.3 - Sun Apr 5, 2009 9:15 AM EDT
    Reply
    {"commentId":6314702,"authorDomain":"mightyblogger"}

    Would be interested to hear you postioning on India as a future ally in these discussions.

    {"commentId":6314702,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"mightyblogger"}
    • 5 votes
    Reply#4 - Sat Apr 4, 2009 12:47 PM EDT
    {"commentId":6315509,"authorDomain":"wharrison55"}

    Well, the key to Pakistan's doing something about the militants in their bosom is somehow convincing the ISI and the other intelligence agencies to get with the program instead of viewing certain militant groups as a wedge to use against the Indians as they do right now. The ISI was implicated in the bombing of the Indian embassy in Kabul last year. How one goes about doing this is the million dollar question.

    {"commentId":6315509,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"wharrison55"}
    • 4 votes
    #4.1 - Sat Apr 4, 2009 1:46 PM EDT
    {"commentId":6315816,"authorDomain":"PalmettoArmadillo"}

    They will only realize it too late, when the extremists are about to have them voted out of office. Then they will find themselves pulling a Musharraf and come to realize he wasn't all that wrong after all.

    {"commentId":6315816,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"PalmettoArmadillo"}
    • 1 vote
    #4.2 - Sat Apr 4, 2009 2:12 PM EDT
    {"commentId":6318068,"authorDomain":"wharrison55"}

    Actually, the MMA (Muttahida Majlis-e-Amal - an umbrella group of religious parties) has little political support in Pakistan proper although their followers hold sway in the NWFP and FATA.

    {"commentId":6318068,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"wharrison55"}
    • 3 votes
    #4.3 - Sat Apr 4, 2009 5:11 PM EDT
    {"commentId":6372106,"authorDomain":"jackjacobs"}

    Thanks for the suggestion. You're right: we can't really discuss south or southwest Asia without discussing India.

    {"commentId":6372106,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"jackjacobs"}
    • 2 votes
    #4.4 - Wed Apr 8, 2009 8:18 AM EDT
    {"commentId":6372269,"authorDomain":"jbdaad"}

    Islam in India - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    ... West Bengal Minority Commission, has said that the real percentage of Muslims in India is at least 20%. Hindutva groups claim in their reports that the Muslim population has reached ...

    Bikini and G-String Are OK But Wearing Hijab or Veil is Bad?

    {"commentId":6372269,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"jbdaad"}
      #4.5 - Wed Apr 8, 2009 8:32 AM EDT
      {"commentId":6443092,"authorDomain":"davidemeadows"}

      It seems to me that a pro-active US military is not in the interest of the US. First, it encourages other nations in Europe to do little. The same may even be said about sub-Saharan Africa.

      Involvement of the US military also brings additional problems to a situation such as stirring up anti-Americanism and alliances that otnerwise might not occur.

      The US military also is bloated in areas that should be reduced and never have been. Unwed mothers in the military recieve expensive medical and housing benefits. Lower-enlisted families are an expense and also a potential disaster in the event of war. Military pay itself for unmarried soldiers more than meets the needs of service members.

      I favor a national service requirement for the healthiest US teens. Marriages would be forbidden, service bonuses would not be available for SM's E-6 and below. Pregnant females would be discharged with no service benefits.

      There is a lot of waste in the military surrounding these issues and options to move away from them are ignored.

      {"commentId":6443092,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"davidemeadows"}
      • 1 vote
      #4.6 - Sun Apr 12, 2009 8:24 AM EDT
      {"commentId":6443378,"authorDomain":"jbdaad"}

      pcbynature

      I favor a national service requirement for the healthiest US teens. Marriages would be forbidden, service bonuses would not be available for SM's E-6 and below. Pregnant females would be discharged with no service benefits.

      SwedishArmed Forces - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

      The Swedish Armed Forces (Swedish: Försvarsmakten), is a Government agency responsible for the operation of the armed forces of Sweden. The primary peace time task of the agency is to train and deploy military forces abroad, while maintaining the long-term ability to defend the country in the event of war.

      There are three service branches: Army, Air Force and Navy, all reporting to the Supreme Commander (Överbefälhavaren, ÖB) who is, apart from the Sovereign, the highest ranking officer in the country. He, in turn, reports to the Ministry of Defence.

      Sweden's military is built on conscription, and until the end of the Cold War nearly all males reaching the age of military service were conscripted. In recent years, the number of conscripted males has been reduced dramatically, while the number of female volunteers has increased slightly. Recruitment has generally shifted towards finding the most motivated recruits, rather than solely on the otherwise most fit for service, although there are exceptions. All soldiers serving abroad are by law required to be volunteers. In 1975 the total number of conscripts was 45,000. By 2003 it was down to 15,000. After the Defence Proposition 2004, the number of troops in training will decrease even further to between 5,000 and 10,000 each year, which emphasizes the need to recruit only the soldiers later prepared to volunteer for international service. As of 2007, the government has discussed dropping the peacetime draft altogether.

      Recruitment has generally shifted towards finding the most motivated recruits, rather than solely on the otherwise most fit for service,

      We have so many layers of military in this country. I would rather see something along the lines of the Swedes. Homeland Security. National Guard, Citizen Corps, Border Guards, Mercenaries, Department of Defense, et cetera. How many personal altogether? We need organization into one comprehensible package. At the very least.

      {"commentId":6443378,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"jbdaad"}
      • 2 votes
      #4.7 - Sun Apr 12, 2009 9:12 AM EDT
      {"commentId":6454063,"authorDomain":"davidemeadows"}

      Good ideas.

      {"commentId":6454063,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"davidemeadows"}
      • 1 vote
      #4.8 - Mon Apr 13, 2009 3:16 AM EDT
      {"commentId":6455794,"authorDomain":"wharrison55"}

      LOL. If we want a glorified police force then by all means lets emulate the Swedes. You guys are priceless. I do agree, however, that we should be rethinking all of our Cold War era security arrangements and the next time an ethnic cleansing bully goes on the rampage in the Balkans the Europeans can deal with it themselves. But had this been the case with Milosevic he'd still be sitting pretty in Belgrade because absent the US the Europeans were generally powerless to deal with him.

      {"commentId":6455794,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"wharrison55"}
      • 1 vote
      #4.9 - Mon Apr 13, 2009 9:08 AM EDT
      {"commentId":6456635,"authorDomain":"jbdaad"}

      the Europeans were generally powerless to deal with him.

      because absent the US

      ?

      {"commentId":6456635,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"jbdaad"}
        #4.10 - Mon Apr 13, 2009 10:07 AM EDT
        {"commentId":6457109,"authorDomain":"davidemeadows"}

        I agree. ?

        {"commentId":6457109,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"davidemeadows"}
        • 1 vote
        #4.11 - Mon Apr 13, 2009 10:34 AM EDT
        {"commentId":6457506,"authorDomain":"wharrison55"}

        The Serbs had damn good air defense capabilities (bolstered by the Russians) that the Europeans on their own would never have been able to overcome absent the USAF. There are any number of articles attesting to this available on the internet on this so both of you can search for them yourself. Although limited in size, France and Great Britain generally have well-disciplined and capable militaries. The rest of the European contingent are generally only suited to constabulary duty.

        {"commentId":6457506,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"wharrison55"}
        • 2 votes
        #4.12 - Mon Apr 13, 2009 10:55 AM EDT
        {"commentId":6457737,"authorDomain":"jbdaad"}

        Why do they not get and spend on their own military?

        {"commentId":6457737,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"jbdaad"}
        • 1 vote
        #4.13 - Mon Apr 13, 2009 11:06 AM EDT
        {"commentId":6470569,"authorDomain":"davidemeadows"}

        The Euros are competitors and should pay for their own defence. Period.

        {"commentId":6470569,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"davidemeadows"}
        • 1 vote
        #4.14 - Tue Apr 14, 2009 1:58 AM EDT
        {"commentId":6470709,"authorDomain":"jbdaad"}

        A true no brainer.

        Europe's Next Big Idea: Strategy and Economics Point to a European ...

        They were goaded by the war in Kosovo, which highlighted in vivid and embarrassing detail Europe's dependence on the U.S. military. ...

        {"commentId":6470709,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"jbdaad"}
        • 1 vote
        #4.15 - Tue Apr 14, 2009 2:42 AM EDT
        {"commentId":6471917,"authorDomain":"davidemeadows"}

        Exactly, JB. Jacobs himself is old-school and represents assumptions by the Def Dept that should not be made. Our competitors should be put on notice regarding military defence. What is happening in Afghanistan is another quagmire...

        {"commentId":6471917,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"davidemeadows"}
        • 1 vote
        #4.16 - Tue Apr 14, 2009 8:02 AM EDT
        {"commentId":6479136,"authorDomain":"jbdaad"}

        pcbynature

        Jacobs himself is old-school and represents assumptions by the Def Dept that should not be made

        Col. Jacobs

        The Executive Branch doesn't have a great deal to say about the budget because, in the end, no money can be spent until the Congress appropriates it. In many cases, of course, the two branches negotiate and agree, but that is most often only at the margins. Especially in the difficult economic environment we have today, it will be tough to convince a legislator that valuable defense jobs in his state or district should be trimmed. And so in the end the government will field a sub-optimal force to cope with what the president says is a problem that we need to solve, and the outcome will be anybody's guess.

        The Executive Branch doesn't have a great deal to say about the budget because, in the end, no money can be spent until the Congress appropriates it

        His views are as valid as ours. I'm glad to hear them. Freedom of speech and all that. cyber Salute to to the Colonel Jacobs.

        {"commentId":6479136,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"jbdaad"}
          #4.17 - Tue Apr 14, 2009 2:19 PM EDT
          Reply
          {"commentId":6315222,"authorDomain":"PalmettoArmadillo"}

          I don't know if you can ever be truly prepared for all contingencies. After all, the goal of most great generals was to assess and attack their enemies weaknesses.

          The need for unconventional forces is necessary in the current situations in Iraq and Afghanistan. They have replaced the jungles and villages of Veit Nam with the human shields and urban jungle of the desert. Can't use napalm on the human shields.

          War is supposed to be ugly, that is why it is to be avoided. We have dressed it up so neatly now that we attempt to conduct it ever so precisely. Now we can have a battle in a village and grandma can still get to the market and do a little shopping. Why should we avoid war when it can be conducted so pleasantly. We have the power to commit genocide, and the restraint not to. Seems a bit counter-productive to the deterrence factor. With the Russians we have always had mutually assured destruction. It has produced a long lasting peace. I think assured destruction would carry the same deterrence factor, if we were not ashamed to use it.

          The days are gone when great armies ammassed in fields to do battle far away from the women and children of the villages. We have allowed the enemy to see our greatest weakness, our sense of honor and decentcy. There is no armor for this weakness. The only armor for it is ruthlessness and we will not lower ourselves to protect ourselves.

          {"commentId":6315222,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"PalmettoArmadillo"}
          • 2 votes
          Reply#5 - Sat Apr 4, 2009 1:27 PM EDT
          {"commentId":6316133,"authorDomain":"stuartcford"}

          It is is complex, but wheat they do need to so is stop bickeringf\ about it in public and setting us all up for failure

          {"commentId":6316133,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"stuartcford"}
            Reply#6 - Sat Apr 4, 2009 2:38 PM EDT
            {"commentId":6316410,"authorDomain":"jackjacobs"}

            The wealth of thought-provoking comments speaks to the primacy of this issue---and its complexity, too. We live in a world that is dangerous, one in which it is becoming difficult to operate in familiar ways. Alas, we must be prepared for a variety of threats, while simultaneously working behind the scenes, as wellinever1 observed, rather than in public. All this takes skill, leadership, resolve, time, patience, and money, few of which we have in their requisite quantity.

            {"commentId":6316410,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"jackjacobs"}
            • 4 votes
            Reply#7 - Sat Apr 4, 2009 3:01 PM EDT
            {"commentId":6318147,"authorDomain":"wharrison55"}

            Col. Jacobs, when it comes to the situation with the Pashtuns on both sides of the Durand Line I would refer you to my earlier The Man Who Would Be President - Obama Goes To Afghanistan. I see a very hot fighting season ahead as the militants try to put pressure on our supply lines into Afghanistan.

            {"commentId":6318147,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"wharrison55"}
            • 4 votes
            #7.1 - Sat Apr 4, 2009 5:17 PM EDT
            {"commentId":6318156,"authorDomain":"amberneve"}

            And the greatest of these is . . . LEADERSHIP!!!!!

            I am still waiting for President Obama's global strategy. And I am tired of the arrogance; statements like, "Only the toughest questions reach my desk . . .". Even I do not talk like that, yet frankly I do have a universal strategy. And it comes to me naturally.

            I have heard absolutely nothing new from Obama. Nothing.

            {"commentId":6318156,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"amberneve"}
            • 3 votes
            #7.2 - Sat Apr 4, 2009 5:18 PM EDT
            {"commentId":6318425,"authorDomain":"amberneve"}

            I think it is important to recognize the marriage between the economic and political orders. As we venture into uncharted economic waters, let's be honest in acknowledging that there is a concurrent entry into a new world political order. The dimensions are global, but the philosophical parameters of globalism are yet to be determined. Instead of living in a condition of denial or open antagonism, usually emotive rather than ideologically reactionary, I propose that we engage ourselves in the construction of this great global assize in the hope that it reflect our own best and just interests.

            {"commentId":6318425,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"amberneve"}
            • 1 vote
            #7.3 - Sat Apr 4, 2009 5:46 PM EDT
            Reply
            {"commentId":6318655,"authorDomain":"amberneve"}

            I see four political powers in the world at present; four, and that is all. They are the United States, the United Nations, the European Union, and Russia.

            They are NOT India, Pakistan, China, Brazil, Iran, Saudi Arabia. They are not Al-Qaeda.

            Approach the world from the perspective of the four. Marginalize the rest as secondary or even lesser actors.

            Ask, What does each of the four powers want and how can you give them what they want? Then tell them what you want. Reach consensus by harmonizing needs.

            {"commentId":6318655,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"amberneve"}
            • 1 vote
            Reply#8 - Sat Apr 4, 2009 6:10 PM EDT
            {"commentId":6319363,"authorDomain":"amberneve"}

            Pertaining to threats, a responsible government should monitor all potential threats, foreign and domestic. Theoretically, a threat could be construed as anything that promotes RADICAL CHANGE; i.e., change in the major spheres of life, such as the economic or political spheres, that occurs too rapidly for popular assimilation. In this respect, the spending policies of Barack Obama -- a radical departure from the debt policies of past administrations -- may be as much or more of a threat to American hegemony as Islamic fascism.

            {"commentId":6319363,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"amberneve"}
            • 2 votes
            Reply#9 - Sat Apr 4, 2009 7:15 PM EDT
            {"commentId":6372165,"authorDomain":"jackjacobs"}

            Years ago, it was common to dismiss deficit spending as irrelevant, because it produces only national debt, which is, the old observation said, only money we owe ourselves. This is no longer true, and as we may painfully discover is one route to hyperinflation. Tread carefully.

            {"commentId":6372165,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"jackjacobs"}
            • 1 vote
            #9.1 - Wed Apr 8, 2009 8:24 AM EDT
            {"commentId":6383162,"authorDomain":"amberneve"}

            However else one characterizes the current state of federal spending, the effect is that of raising taxes. Government is getting bigger and demanding more, while the populace ekes by with fewer rights and more responsibility. The phrase was "tax and spend"; now it is "spend and tax". And this is called CHANGE!

            {"commentId":6383162,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"amberneve"}
            • 1 vote
            #9.2 - Wed Apr 8, 2009 5:04 PM EDT
            Reply
            {"commentId":6320792,"authorDomain":"amberneve"}

            See The NY Times article, "Pentagon Weighs Cuts and Revisions of Weapons",

            http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/04/washington/04defense.html?_r=1&ref=politics

            {"commentId":6320792,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"amberneve"}
            • 1 vote
            Reply#10 - Sat Apr 4, 2009 9:27 PM EDT
            {"commentId":6342009,"authorDomain":"kpeltonen85"}

            In war, there are some things you can always count on. In the modern era, that is guerilla warfare. With the ability for the common man to make extraordinary violence out of common materials (guns being the least threat now, it seems), it stands to reason that our primary goal should have been IED countermeasures. They aren't a new concept and are an attractive, low-cost, low-personnel undertaking. It doesn't matter how big your MOAB is, it can't fight effective urban warfare for you.

            As for personnel shortcomings, I'll be doing my part and will hopefully be field-ready a year from now.

            {"commentId":6342009,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"kpeltonen85"}
            • 2 votes
            Reply#11 - Mon Apr 6, 2009 3:01 PM EDT
            {"commentId":6354440,"authorDomain":"mikekathycook"}

            I live in Boeing country and am more than a little puzzled by one of Gates's proposed cuts, i.e. not buying more C-17's. No matter what kind of a war you are fighting you have to get there and get there with a lot of stuff. Say this summer our forces in Afghanistan become cut off from all land routes for supply, due to Taliban activities and shifting political alliances among former Soviet states. Airborne resupply may be expensive, but it is a lot more expensive when you use numerous small airplanes rather than a few huge ones. The Berlin airlift was a classic example of using a lot of small airplanes (mostly C-47's) to make an enormous political point at a great cost. Flying coal into a major city, for goodness sake! Crazy!

            It could be that there are two types of thinkers in the Obama administration. The pinhead type is thinking that global warming is truly the greatest threat to man and that it is absolutely proved that burning petroleum fuels cause said warming. This type of thinker will hate armored forces and hate the C-17. The other type of thinker is the business school graduate who can squeeze a penny until it turns into a dime. This guy is thinking that we may need a lot of airlift capacity sure enough, but as it happens the USA has huge boneyards full of civilian airliners that are rapidly being taken out of service.

            Airliners being subject to safety regulations, most of these airplanes are perfectly airworthy right up to their last flight when they are put into storage. It wouldn't take a lot to convert them all into cargo carriers. For that matter, if the world really gets nasty the President could nationalize all private air cargo carriers and he would suddenly have a huge fleet of cargo airplanes. They might have Fed Ex or UPS painted on the fuselage and they wouldn't be suitable for hauling armored vehicles, but armored forces may be an extravagance that Mr. Gates will fore go in fighting the next major wars.

            I have always been an advocate of taking several dozen 747's and L-1011 aircraft that are sitting somewhere in the American West gathering dust and converting them into the world's largest cruise missiles. Not hard to do, really, just pack them full of C-4 or fuel air mixes and have technicians from BAE Systems Inc. work on the autopilots for a few days. Actually, a stripped down 747 should carry at least 300,000 lbs of explosives plus its fuel load.

            Conventional warplanes would have to open up a hole in the sky so that these 500 mph heavyweight beasts could squeak through, but then you dive them one after another into the same target and it doesn't matter if the facilities at Natanz are a mile deep, the Mother of All Bunker Busters is going to blast its way down and completely take out the target, all without using a nuclear explosion.

            Admittedly, I have a dog in this fight because sitting in my workshop is a mock-up for a blended wing body design heavy lifter seaplane that would fly anywhere in the world and land on any 2,000 ft long flat surface: sand, swamp, or a wheat field. This airplane would have a gross takeoff weight of 1.75 million pounds, 1.1 million of which would be payload. I call it the SE4BWB. It would cost about as much as two C-17's but would perform versatile missions such as being able to land in 10-ft swells on any ocean and have seakeeping characteristics suitable to stay on station there for weeks, a lot like a mini-amphibious ship, flying off helicopters and the JSF STOL variants, not to mention drones.

            {"commentId":6354440,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"mikekathycook"}
            • 1 vote
            Reply#12 - Tue Apr 7, 2009 11:15 AM EDT
            {"commentId":6355006,"authorDomain":"farmer"}

            Shades of Hughes and the Spruce Goose!

            {"commentId":6355006,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"farmer"}
            • 1 vote
            #12.1 - Tue Apr 7, 2009 11:38 AM EDT
            {"commentId":6358592,"authorDomain":"jbdaad"}
            {"commentId":6358592,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"jbdaad"}
              #12.2 - Tue Apr 7, 2009 1:57 PM EDT
              {"commentId":6372199,"authorDomain":"jackjacobs"}

              It is more than a little strange that Secretary Gates said that we need more lift---which makes sense if we have a small-war capability---but that we won't buy a lot more of it.

              {"commentId":6372199,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"jackjacobs"}
                #12.3 - Wed Apr 8, 2009 8:26 AM EDT
                {"commentId":6373932,"authorDomain":"wharrison55"}

                Col. Jacobs it would also be helpful if the European contingent of ISAF increased their own lift capabilities. I presume you're aware that the Germans had to lease Tupolevs from the Russians and Ukraine(PDF) to get their soldiers into Afghanistan? And the Aibus A400M military transport program remains mired and may have to be abandoned altogether. Another complicating factor is the altitude in which a lot of the combat operations are taking place in near the Durand Line. As you know helicopters don't function well above 9,000 ft. and especially in summer when payloads have to be reduced due to the diminished lift capabilities as a result of the combination of altitude and higher air temperatures.

                {"commentId":6373932,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"wharrison55"}
                • 2 votes
                #12.4 - Wed Apr 8, 2009 10:07 AM EDT
                {"commentId":6375652,"authorDomain":"jbdaad"}

                Germans had to lease Tupolevs from the Russians and Ukraine That report made no sense from the git go. There`s plenty of commercial airlenes that are hurting or money that could be incorporated for transport. We`ve done that over the years in a pinch.

                {"commentId":6375652,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"jbdaad"}
                  #12.5 - Wed Apr 8, 2009 11:31 AM EDT
                  {"commentId":6377176,"authorDomain":"wharrison55"}

                  Only problem with that is that one cannot put a Leopard tank or other heavy equipment on a commercial airliner.

                  {"commentId":6377176,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"wharrison55"}
                  • 2 votes
                  #12.6 - Wed Apr 8, 2009 12:38 PM EDT
                  {"commentId":6377445,"authorDomain":"jbdaad"}

                  Did we have a successful Airbus here?

                  Airbus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

                  Airbus has subsidiaries in the United States, Japan and China. The company is known for producing and marketing the first commercially viable fly by wire airliner.

                  Can`t imagine why their program is having dificulties.

                  {"commentId":6377445,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"jbdaad"}
                    #12.7 - Wed Apr 8, 2009 12:50 PM EDT
                    Reply
                    {"commentId":6374975,"authorDomain":"mikekathycook"}

                    If I may extend my commercial for the SE4BWB just a little bit--the Spruce Goose was only one large seaplane design--both Britain and Germany had four-engine flying boats and the USA had a four-engine variant of the PBY. Interest in large seaplanes died after 1945 because land airplanes are much more aerodynamically efficient, until the Russians began toying with stubby-winged seaplanes designed to carry huge loads on long-duration missions only a few feet above the water flying surface effect. One of these unusual designs was dubbed the "Caspian Monster."

                    The major problem with the stub-wing design is that it took a huge amount of power to get it out of the water. Once flying, it was reasonably economical and could cruise along with four out of eight engines shut down. Unfortunately, the stub wing design made for a very rough ride as flying surface effect tends to be a very rattling experience and stub wings make the turbulence worse.

                    The Spruce Goose approached the problem from a radically different idea. It had a huge 320 foot wingspan, which meant it could cruise in surface effect at 160 feet above the water and would be relatively free of the rattling and shaking that plagues smaller airplanes flying surface effect. It helped that this long wing was highly flexible. Unfortunately, the Spruce Goose was extremely underpowered, as its eight engines produced 4,000hp each for a total of 32,000hp. Even one engine failing would be very bad news for a Spruce Goose.

                    The modern jet engines on the Boeing 777 design can produce 120,00hp each. A four-motor seaplane based on this size engine would have nearly a half-million horsepower to work with, which is ample to support a million lb payload and extremely VSTOL soft (or no) landing field characteristics. The main drawback of such a design is that it would be a fuel guzzler, but if you intend to fly emergency supplies to a tsunami or a hurricane disaster and there is no 10,000 foot concrete runway available to land on, is fuel efficiency that big an issue?

                    {"commentId":6374975,"threadId":"546019","contentId":"2639671","authorDomain":"mikekathycook"}
                      Reply#13 - Wed Apr 8, 2009 10:58 AM EDT
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